Wondering what is the best website design to help you stand out? How can your website help you attract new leads? Today on the show, website expert, Reese Spykerman, shares what you absolutely need to have on your website to stand out and turn browsers into new leads. You'll also learn the three biggest mistakes on websites that send people away and how you can fix them.


The Best Website Design

Wondering what is the best website design to help you stand out? How can your website help you attract new leads?

Today on the show, website expert, Reese Spykerman, shares what you absolutely need to have on your website to stand out and turn browsers into new leads.

You’ll also learn the three biggest mistakes on websites that send people away and how you can fix them.

Connect with Reese at http://www.designbyreese.com/fixes or on Instagram.


Wondering what is the best website design to help you stand out? How can your website help you attract new leads? Today on the show, website expert, Reese Spykerman, shares what you absolutely need to have on your website to stand out and turn browsers into new leads. You'll also learn the three biggest mistakes on websites that send people away and how you can fix them.

In this episode you will learn:

  • a pretty website doesn’t sell.
  • the three biggest problems on websites that send people away (and how you can fix them.)
  • what copy changes to make on your website to attract customers.
  • what kind of photos really matter on your homepage and about me page.
  • the one word you should avoid



Full Transcription at the bottom of this blog post.

Before you go, I’d love to connect with you and give you some gifts to help you grow your online presence!

Instagram @allisonscholes

Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/socialmediaformompreneurs/

Work with me: https://ascholes.wpengine.com/coaching/

Free Caption Templates: https://ascholes.wpengine.com/free-captions/

Personal Branding Workbook: https://ascholes.wpengine.com/rock-your-personal-brand/

Full Transcription:

Podcast Intro:

Are you aware that you might have some key parts of your website wrong and you could be losing leads and sales? No worries. Because my guest today, Reese Spykerman, is here to change just that.

Reese is a website expert who has spent more than 15 years working closely with entrepreneurs and brands on their online marketing.

On today’s show, Reese is sharing what you absolutely need to have on your website to stand out and turn browsers into new leads. We also get into three big problems on websites and how you can fix them. This episode is loaded with information, hacks, and how-to strategies.

Clear all your distractions and grab that pen and paper. Let’s dive in.


Podcast Interview:

Hey, Reese. Welcome to the show.

Hey Alison, I’m so excited to be here with you and thanks for having me on what an honor. Oh, okay.

Thank you. I’m excited to have you, and I know we’re going to jump into website branding. I love talking about branding, but I have yet to have anyone on my show talk about like the design elements and the copy elements to really attract the right audience and basically get those leads, get those clients. But before we jump into all your wisdom on that, can you tell us what you do and who you are?

Yeah, that’s a great question. I I’m in a conversion expert and my background is both in copywriting and design as well as business strategy in the main market that I serve are women who have product based businesses that are online. So basically e-commerce shop owners, but I spent years working with service-based business owners, um, coaches, consultants, authors. I mean, that’s not really a service base, but you get what I mean. So I have a lot of experience in a lot of the different industries, but over time I just found, I really enjoyed working with the product based business owners, especially women in that realm.

Really cool. So you have spent a lot of time in website design, correct?

Yes. After I graduated college with a degree in journalism, I worked in the publishing industry for a little while and I didn’t really like it that or the media. And there was always this side of me that wanted to be a bit more creative, even though I’m quite an analytical person. There’s that creative part of me. So I got into website design during the heyday of blogging around 2007, 2008, when the internet wasn’t as noisy as it is now, but people were starting to do personal blogs. And that’s how I started to learn to do website design. It evolved to me working with businesses and corporations. And I did that for at least a decade. So my background is very strongly in design, but in the past few years, we’re going to talk about this a little bit. I’ve started to really weave in more of my background as a writer to bring copywriting back into the fold. And actually in many ways have designed take the backseat.

That’s really cool. And that leads me into my next question because you’ve spent years as a website designer and I think one of your big messages is pretty doesn’t sell. So can you explain that a little bit?

Yes. So imagine you have spent three or $5,000 on a website, whatever it is, and it’s not getting you any leads or sales. Well, congratulations. What do you do now? What I saw Alison is when I was cutting my teeth on design website design for people over years, I remember drooling over those really pretty websites. You know, it’s kind of like when we open an issue of Magnolia and drool over someone’s kitchen and I even as a designer would have like some FOMO around design thinking, Oh my goodness, my work isn’t even like nearly to that level of attractiveness because we as human beings, we’re drawn to beauty. It’s just, you know, it’s like you walk into TJ Maxx and you’ll be drawn to a new skincare product simply because you love the packaging for example. But when it comes to our websites, what I learned is that pretty alone doesn’t sell.

Now that doesn’t mean you have to be ugly to sell. Not at all and ugly can work against people, but pretty is not enough. So let me give you an example right now, there’s this polar trend of neutral and tote pallets. Maybe you’ve seen this, especially when you see it on Instagram, but it’s also really popular in websites. And I saw, for example, the stunningly gorgeous website for a women’s fitness brand and I drooled over it, but it lacked these key elements that help people know to buy. Or if you’re, you’re a service-based person listening to this and you’re using that same palette and you think it looks really pretty, the problem with pretty and why I say pretty doesn’t sell is that sometimes in our quest for prettiness, we ignore putting the things on a website that will trigger someone to do the thing we want them to do, like sign up for our email list or buy the thing, right? So we need triggers in both our design and copy to us off the fence, into becoming either a buyer or a prospect or get on our list. And sometimes that means you have to be willing to make some sacrifices with the overall astatic of your look. And a lot of people struggle with this. They get really fixated on aesthetic, but it’s just not helping people make a buying decision. Does that make sense?

It does. And do you think too, it just kind of came to my mind cause I’m so glad you’re bringing this up because I actually did something totally different on one of my landing pages that I just released a freebie actually that I just released this week. And of course we want to stay. They always the term on-brand, which I’m kind of getting sick of that term on brand. I wanted to be more relatable because I was creating a freebie for moms who are struggling with getting all the things done in their business. So I created a really cool workbook that has a link to a spreadsheet that really just maps it out for them. And so I was thinking about like this landing page, and instead of me putting these perfect are these like picture perfect photos of me like branding photos. It was a selfie of me with my kids in the car, you know, making a funny photo. And then one of me laying on my bed with my laptop and someone responded, I love those pictures. And I was like, really, because I was trying to remember, there’s a relate-ability factor in here. And I talk about that all the time on Instagram. And I think we have to remember that when it comes to our website, is who are we trying to attract? So yes, we want to stay on brand and our aesthetics, but there’s also that relate-ability factor. Would you agree with that?

Oh, a million percent. So let’s break down the wonderful example you just gave from your own experiment and how it applies to design. So when you used your selfie type photos, it made you approachable. And when you become approachable, your audience can believe that what you have is possible for them. But if you kind of are too polished, I mean, there’s this, you know, there’s a debate about this and I could come out on either side. There’s something about the Polish that sometimes can make us look like an authority to people, right? But at times I wonder, especially after the past year, if what people are craving is connection. And when we use the super polished photos or I will give you a design example in a minute, we put up a wall between us and the people that we are in service to. So for design, here’s what can happen. You go download or you buy this gorgeous theme or template. And it looks like something that one of these Instagram influencers who has half a million followers, and she’s always on the beach with her perfectly Photoshop, but she’d be using it on her website. Am I right? You’re you know what I’m talking

About? I know exactly what you’re talking about,

The, the problem with a design like this, that it looks like the kind of thing that she might use is that it puts up that barrier between us and the people coming to experience us through our websites. So I actually, in many ways, advocate for a website design approach, that’s fairly minimal, not a lot of bells and whistles going on, and we’re going to probably dig into that a little bit more, but I would love for people to feel permission that they don’t need to get their design like so high end looking just because someone that they follow site looks that way, or they’ve been told that by a marketing guru, you don’t, you really don’t. You can release yourself of this need to have it super pretty. Now you might want it that way. And I would hope that maybe by the end of this conversation in this interview today, perhaps you’ve started to think about some of the other things that might be as important, if not more important than the aesthetic of your site and even of your photos.

And I think too, we have to remember the message that we’re putting out there to our audience, the so-called lifestyle. We don’t want it to come across as unattainable, because if it comes across as unattainable, then they’re not going to want to work with us.

That’s yeah, that’s exactly it. And it reminds me of something I call like the Ferrari facade, marketers, and it’s where, I mean, I see dudes do this a lot, but there are women who do this too, where they’ve created on Instagram and in their marketing, this facade of this lifestyle. And they may be attracting a certain type of people. But when we try to emulate that, and that isn’t really truly authentically who we are, we were repairing people. And here’s something really critical that I think that might make it hit home for your audience. We may be calling in the kind of people that we don’t want to work with. So let’s say Alison, you’re a really chill and easygoing and kind person. I’d like to think that I am too. So I’m imagining both of us like to work with people who have that similar personality, those similar values. And so when we are approachable in our marketing, we’re drawing in people who have that resonance with us like that, right. And we’re repelling the people who might just be looking for the super polished facade. So there’s a really compelling reason I think, to let go of it, because think about who you might be pulling in and who you might be pushing away with your approach.

I like that. Now, can you touch base on, what do you think are like the biggest problems that you see on websites that are sending people away? You know, they’re, they’re leaving your site and can you tell how to fix them?

Yes. This is one of my favorite questions. And part of why is a couple of things I’m going to list are pretty easy to fix. So I love giving people in an interview like this, some easy wins and the biggest one, not the biggest, but a really big one that I see is having in the header of your website. So when we mean header, we mean that top part where you usually have your logo and your navigation. That’s the first thing that people see when they come to your site. And I would argue, it’s probably one of the most important parts of your website. So when you, in this header, when you put social media icons in there, you are sending people away from your website. And I understand the thinking behind it. A lot of times, people, either they have a theme and they’ve been put in there.

So they keep them there, or they add them there because in their mind, I think they’re thinking I want to give people options for how they connect with me. I would love it. If they’d rather connect me on Instagram, maybe I’ll grow my follower, count over there. But what happens is because we, as human beings have the attention span of a gnat, someone will see the icon in your header, and more often than not, they’re like, Ooh, Instagram, you know, like even in their subconscious mind, they click it and you think, okay, great. They’re looking at my feed, but the problem is they get back to Instagram and what, what loads, they start to see their notifications. They see the red heart or the heart with like the little red dot. They see the DM with the dot and they have forgotten all about you before. There’s even a chance for them to follow you because we are that so quickly and easily distracted by something else. So this is such an easy one to fix, and you can see why it’s like getting someone off your site and forgetting about you way too quickly. We want to keep them on the website. And I would really love to hear what you think about that. Alison, since so much of your business is marketing on Instagram. I would love your thoughts on this.

So I actually do not have my links in the top navigation. You actually have to scroll all the way at the bottom and say, connect with me here. It’s always at the bottom of my website, that’s where mine are placed. And I would agree with you because I, if you have a freebie, right, you’re trying to build your email list. Why would you want them to go to that freebie? And then immediately see Instagram or Facebook and they click on they’re gone because we don’t, even though I love Instagram, we don’t own it. Your website is yours. So you want them there and you want them to consume your content on your website and hopefully sign up for that freebie. And then there, you know, hopefully stay on your email.

So well said, it’s basically, you know, that principle of owned land versus borrowed land. And we are going to want to leverage borrow land as much as we can, but always remember it can be pulled out from under us, but our website cannot in general and neither can our email list. So as much as marketing efforts can focus on those, we want to do that. And you asked for another example of what sends people away. And I will give you one that I saw on a jewelry website when I was visiting it. Um, someone in a Facebook group that I’m in asks, can you please check out my website and review it? And she was just asking the group. And I went and I looked and I went on my phone and she had all this weird background video. And it was obscuring my ability to even see her products.

And it was so hard to figure out how to get to her product page. And I was very persistent in trying to figure this out because I was bothered by the whole thing. But I’m weird. I’m like a website strategist. Most people would be like, I don’t understand what’s going on. I’m confused. I’m going to leave. So I don’t like things, for example, like a background video, that’s sitting at the top, like in that top section of your website or on any other part of your website where it might be obscuring people from just reading about you. And in the case of a product based business, senior products are reading more about your services and the fix to this is really simple. Like keep the actual design and layout of your website. Simple, you know, watch out for using things like a spin to win wheel or background videos or weird animations. Not only do you not need those to get people to sign up for your stuff, but oftentimes they’re also slowing down our website and the slower our website is the more likely people are to bounce. Right. They’ll bounce right off it because they don’t have the patience like we talked about.

So what do you think is like, um, I’m trying to think, like someone is just on Google and they happen to come across your website. Okay. What do you think is the most important thing that they need to see to stay?

Ooh, I love this question because normally,

Really most people come to your website cause they’re looking for a freebie or they’ve been directed for a link to a blog post. Right. But if people are just on Google, searching for products, maybe even service base and they come across your homepage, how do you grab their attention? Do they, do you need to have a photo of you on the homepage? Do they need to know who they’re working with? Cause I’m a big advocate for that.

Yes. I think that this is a question where there’s a few different ways to skin this Pat, and I’m glad you asked it because you have my own wheels turning, especially when you brought up like, Oh, people might be there because they want to sign up for the freebie. In general, when we’re talking, especially about a service-based business, I’ve always been a pretty big advocate of on the top part of say your homepage so that we call it this hero top 20%. I’ve always really recommended that people have a very compelling piece of copy about their freebie, their lead magnet, and then the button. But the interesting thing that you just helped me see, Alison, and I appreciate this is once people do that, they sign up and they’re what usually taken to a thank you page. Some people just automate it through convert kit and it’s not even your own branded page.

So in this interview, I want to revise my thinking a little bit or expand on it and say, I still like that because when you can collect their email address, you can be in a longer-term relationship with them. But I think what would be cool is on the page that they load afterwards. So your thank you for signing up. I like to set expectations. So thanks for signing up just to make sure you get it, you know, go look, it might be stuck in spam or promotions. Some of that then can you use this opportunity while you have their attention to put some other catchy things like maybe you have a killer blog post that you wrote, you know, this Epic one, that’s really, it gets good SEO juice, or you know, people really like it. Maybe you have a graphic and you say like, while you’re here, I think you might like to read, you know, my post about how the heck to manage being a mom with your kids at home, in a pandemic or whatever it is.

That’s really closely related to that interest. Your audience just expressed, and then you’re keeping them on your website that way. And so there’s that one method. But the other thing is, is let’s say they didn’t sign up for your freebie right away. Maybe they got to through Google and because your new to them, they weren’t really interested right away in that freebie at the top of the page, they want to learn more before they commit and give their email address. Fine. The number one thing that I think that people can do to retain attention is focused on their copywriting and the way they need to focus on their copywriting. And this is one big mistake I see is they need to make their copywriting about their audience, their customer, not about themselves. And that really trips up a lot of mompreneurs, other service-based business owners, everyone, they think that their website is about them, but it’s actually about their customer and their audience. And when you use the word you, that is the most powerful word that you can use in your copywriting to stop them in their tracks.

I love that. And that just confirms what I teach for Instagram. I say, Instagram is no longer about you. Take yourself off the pedestal and put your audience on the pedestal. How are you going to help them? It’s about them. And that’s really cool because, um, I actually have a static thank you page. And it says, Hey, your freebie is on its way, but hold on. If you want to build your brand and presence on Instagram, I have a load of freebies. Grab them here better yet. Join my community of awesome mom, pretty words in my free Facebook group. So it’s like static website page and they go on another journey and they can choose where they want to go from there. And that has worked really well for me because that’s how I’m driving traffic to my Facebook group and driving traffic to the podcast. So it’s really cool.

Hmm. I love that. So you’re, you know, you’re already one step ahead with your thank you page. You’re doing a great job. I also like that you’re giving them some options and let me kind of distill why a lot of times I’m a big fan of, don’t give people too many choices. We want them to maybe take one decision at a time. But when we’re thinking about the context of where people’s brains and behavior is at, when they’re on that, thank you page after they’ve signed up for your free thing like that as a place to give them some options about what might fit them best. Maybe it’s the Facebook group. Maybe it’s your podcast. Maybe it’s some of your blog articles. I think that’s a really great place to give people a choice in the decision.

And I think it’s cool to give them more free options. Yeah. And more ways to have the immediate wins. I’m a big fan of immediate wins because it takes a while. I mean, what do you think is pretty average for someone to start working with you? Don’t they need to see your stuff more than like seven times. Oh, so after signing up for one freebie and then going right to your sales page for coaching, I don’t think that’s going to work. They don’t know you yet.

And you know, I think when we do that, unless you really are a very sophisticated marketer, you have an awesome ad strategy. You have all these funnels like in, I don’t think people need all that stuff. What we need to think again about what is going through our potential customer prospects minds. And it’s very much like dating, right? So think back to when we were dating for you and me, it was probably a long time ago, but the lead magnet is kind of like just someone asking us out on the date. Now imagine we go on the date and then they say, do you want to hop into bed? That’s kind of like, what’s happening when you say, Hey, you got my lead magnet. Now, would you like my $3,000 coaching program? I mean, please, it’s a little bit insulting,

Right? I like your analogy there too on the date. And unfortunately there’s people out there that have that expectation. So,

And I’m hoping when I give an analogy like that, it might help them understand the problem with that marketing approach. And I think Alison, I’m curious your take on this, but I see a lot of people and I don’t blame them at all, but they’ll see what’s work. What they think is working in marketing for someone else. And they emulate it without necessarily thinking through these kinds of things that we’re talking about here in this call. Like, do you see this a lot with people you work with or your audience?

Absolutely. And my audience, those that know me very well. Know my tagline don’t be like, that is like my ultimate tagline because my audience knows I’m a huge Marvel nerd. And I absolutely love the villain. Loki. He sneaky, he’s tricky. He can mimic, he can transform. And I always say, you can love low-key in the movies, but do not be like low-key on Instagram. Because at the end of the day, the mimicking, the transforming, the trickery never works out for him at the end of the day. And I always say, it’s not going to work out for you on Instagram. You really have to dig deep and know your true authenticity, copying what other people are doing. All the transformations, all the mimicking it’s going to fly.

What an amazing example don’t and tagline. That’s brilliant. Don’t be like low-key and you just encapsulated the problem in a singular character or persona that people can resonate with my hats off to you. I love that.

I need to get it in, in a t-shirt don’t be like Loki.

I think so because it’s also life advice, does it not

Right? Exactly. And people know that I love Loki. And on days that I’m feeling a little snarky, I do have a t-shirt that says Loki made me do it. And so I always just blame it on that point to my t-shirt low-key made me do it. So, so I do have another question for you because I know you are a big proponent of, you need to make your website about your audience. It’s not about you, but let’s, let’s talk about the about me page, because I think that’s a really big struggle because that’s, when you want to showcase who you are, your authenticity to your audience, but we also need to make it about our audience. So how do we do that? What is the important elements for an about me page? Cause I know I’m struggling with it.

Hmm. You are not the only one. The struggle is real. And I understand why, because it baked into the term about me. It creates a whole lot of confusion. When you have someone like me coming in on your podcast and saying, you need to make it about your audience. It’s like, well, how do I do that, Reese? I first want to address something that I think you asked earlier and I didn’t get to. And it was about photos of yourself. And I do think photos help us create a connection with people as evidenced by the story you gave of yourself fees on this particular landing page you had and the connection it created with someone. So I think an about page and even your homepage are both appropriate places to have a photo of you. You do not need all 20 of your best photos from your photo shoot on there though.

Right? I, from a formula point of view and I don’t usually like formulas, but I think they help people maybe have one of you at the top. Right? And then you have one, two thirds of the way down the page on your about page. When we’re talking about photos, I’ve seen a few different techniques. And what I think, especially for your mom for newer audience would really cool on the about page with photos is one of you alone, right? Because you’re a mom for newer. And I think lot of women in this audience are proud of the thing that they’re doing on their own for themselves. Even though they might be a wife and they have children, they’re a mom. So one of you on your own, and then one of you with your family, you know, a casual photo, it doesn’t have to be super posed.

Like you paid 500 bucks to get it done. It can be one of the selfies that Alison talked about. But when we are talking about the about page, like how do we approach it in a way that is about our audience and about us? One of the methods I like to do is we need to know we need, and you had a recent episode, you talked with someone about niching. I thought it was a great episode. So we need to know what is either the problem, the desire or the pain point that we are solving or addressing for our audience. Okay. And there’s multiple ones. It’s not always one. So the about page might look like this. We think that the one that’s desire or pain point that is probably maybe the biggest one. And we start our “about page” copy with something like this. Um, well Alison, why don’t you tell me a little bit before I’ll you do a riff off yours? What is one of the Baker? Your either pains or desires that your work solves for your audience?

My audience struggles with showing up consistently on Instagram with their own authentic content. That is their biggest struggle. Okay. And unfortunately, they’re watching other people, so I’m always like, uh, pump the brakes, stop consuming so much content and we’re going to do, you know, and I help them build their own authentic content, but we’re going to do it with simplicity and control because I don’t want them to feel that Instagram is controlling them.

All right. This is fantastic because what you just said to me, you go listen back to your recording, get a transcript of this because you just told me some of your copy, basically how you just talked in normal human terms is your copy, but you’ve, we’ve got a headline at the top and I’m riffing here. Like if I had more time to sit down, I’d refine this more, but it looks like I see you struggling to show up consistently with authentic content on Instagram. And then you describe a bit more of the problem, right? And what did you say? Stop, stop consuming. So you’d say something like the answer isn’t in XYZ, whatever it is. Um, the answer isn’t in consuming so much, it’s in, um, simplicity and control. I’m Alison Scholz, and I’m here to show you how to do that. And then you go into a little bit more and where you want to do is you want to bridge this bio about you, that sneaks and things that are also about them.

So in other words, as you’re talking about you, Alison, or for anyone listening, you know, thinking about how this process applies to their page, what is it about you? And it doesn’t have to be everything, but could you take 30 to 40% of the things about you both personally and professionally and weave them in a way that’s like I saw women doing acts and that’s why I decided to do Y and then you also want to sneak in some personal tidbits about yourself in there. And one of my favorite ways to do that is actually I have a little separate section at the end. Like things you don’t really need to know about me, but you might want to know anyway or something like that. And it’s like, I don’t know, you’ve got a golden retriever and he’s 18 years old and he poops too much stuff like that.

You know, that’s going to make someone laugh. That’s going to make them understand that your coworker you’re human. You’re cool. So you have a little section like that. So can you see how we start? We pull them in on the about page by still making it about them. And then we it’s like this, this almost like a funnel or a transition from this is why you, you, Alison are doing the work you’re doing, here’s some more about you and why what’s your credibility? Why should they listen to you? What’s in it for them. And then all the way down at the bottom, more about like you as a human being, what are, you know, I have on mine that I love chips and salsa. Like I can’t imagine a world without and stuff like that.

That’s awesome. And as you were describing that, the, the thing that I really understood or took away from that is we, yes. We need to talk about ourselves, but position ourselves as the guide to help our audience, because we’ve experienced what they’re experiencing now, that’s kind of how I’m visualizing what the about me page would be is yes, I’m this I’ve experienced what you’re experiencing and I can guide you. I can get you there. So you’re still talking about yourself, but you’re talking about yourself in a way of how you are going to help your audience. Would you agree?

Yeah. Oh yeah. Like here is why, if this describes you audience, here’s why I’m the guide for you. Right? So, and what I love about this approach is I think it really helps anyone listening get out of their head around, well, what do I say? How do I talk about myself? What’s important. Think about as, what do you do that helps you be the guide for your audience? What do you believe in, for example, you know, what are some you just listed for yourself? Some things that you think are really important. What are some myths you want to dispel? For example, what are the lines in the sand that you draw? And when you get more specific, I just, I can’t help, but want to give this tip because I really want to help people here when you get more specific and it’s not just like, Oh, I want to empower women.

Okay, well maybe instead you want to empower single moms who, um, this is bad, but like we’re left at the altar and now are scrambling to make ends, meet, to find there, you know, to be, feel grounded in themselves again, and kick at work or whatever it is. The more specific you can be the better, because when you are specific, the people that you help see themselves in the picture you paint and it’s okay. If in the picture you paint, they don’t check off every box. They’re still going to see enough of themselves in that specific picture that they’re like, I want Alison, I like this woman. She’s who I need.

And I think too, it’s important to, um, make sure that you tell your audience how you are different and how you do things different. And you’re not afraid to do it different. I think that’s, what’s going to help you stand out from the crowd

100%, because Instagram quote coaches, I’m using quotes marks, here are a dime a dozen, right? But as you talked about in the niche episode, you did, you decided that you are going to help mompreneurs with their Instagram feed in this specific way. Right? So yes, whenever you can point out how you are different, that’s going to help. And I want to speak a little bit too. I think the mindset, things that go on here, I think a lot of us, wherever you are in your journey of growth and self-development, we run into mindset, things around this because being different, what may have been stamped down in us as children. Okay. And culturally speaking in society, we’re often taught to kind of just be cheap and go with the flow and do what everyone else is doing. You know, don’t make a ruckus. And so I think there’s some fears around being willing to draw a line in the sand, being willing to say what you stand for, what makes you different, but understand that when you do that things blow up.

I have seen it happen in my own business. I’m guessing Allison’s nodding. I’m guessing that you have to. When I got really specific, not just about who I served, but how I am as a person I pulled in the right people. Like I pulled in the right women to my group program who will just laugh in my coaching calls because out of the blue I’ll throw in a blunt thing and that’s what attracted them to me. Right. But 10 years ago, I would have been afraid to let that woman show and I would have never pulled that those women into my program.

I think you’re speaking to the women who are always looking for that perfection aspect of themselves. And really perfection just doesn’t exist. It never will exist. And perfection is boring. And I’ve learned that from my son, because I don’t know if you know, but my youngest is on the spectrum. He has autism and he rocks it. He knows that, you know, he’s unique. And he says all the time, well, I’m, I’m glad because being normal is boring. And I’m like, you’re exactly right. Body being normal is boring. And a lot of my sassiness and my uniqueness and creativity stems from him. Yeah. And so this whole, you know, perception of being perfect or making sure all your ducks in a row, a lot of people don’t even launch their websites because they feel like it has to be perfect. Just launch the dang thing. Right?

Oh, also if you don’t like it, you can change it tomorrow. If you’re uncomfortable with the copy, it is not setting into me. I mean, yeah, there’s the internet archive and everything, you know what, no one is going to come and like, hold that against you. And if they do, they need to sit down. So your website can be this evolving thing. It’s not a one and done. It’s not, you got to get it right out of the gate. Just get the darn thing off. Exactly. I love it. Oh, thank you so much, breeze. This was an awesome conversation. I cannot wait for women to listen to it and I really want them to connect with you. So where can they find you on social, on social? They can find me on Instagram @reesespykerman.

And I also have a free gift for your audience. If they’re interested, it’s my freebie 10 common website mistakes that make you lose leads and sales and how to fix them fast. And I’ll be Frank. A lot of my work is for women who are in e-commerce. So if you sign up for the freebie, you might find that, you know, you aren’t my particular market, but I’m still happy for you to get that. And you can get that at design, by reese.com forward slash fixes. Awesome. I’ll make sure that your information is in the show notes, and I really enjoyed our conversation today and thank you so much for being on the show. Oh, thank you for having me. I love this.

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